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Truth or Fiction?


Mr. Clean
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I was looking up comments people have made about Donald Trump and when I got to this one picture I thought "my god is this really what people believe?".

You know the great thing about people when compared to religion is the fact that while God cannot really be disproven or proven with certainty it's about faith. But with people the belief in a particular person is really another way of saying people didn't do their research.

8e703662f0a91cb3a3a74b73b1f3ffca.jpg

 

That there is the image in question. Each of those statements made about Trump believe it or not is false. Lets go over them briefly for those who care about what's being told to them.

 

1) Trump is a barbarian because he supports waterboarding.

Well lets look at what waterboarding is. It's a form of torture where water is covered over a person's face which causes the person to have a sensation of drowning. They don't actually drown the victim nor does it cause any physical harm to their being and it leaves them alive. It's actually one of the more humane forms of torture out there and comparing it to the history of torture it's undeniable that while you may think it's wrong you'd rather be waterboarded than be the victim of one of these for example

http://list25.com/25-most-brutal-torture-techniques-ever-devised/

 

Another important point is who waterboarding is being used on and will probably be used on during a Trump Presidency. It's ISIS Trump is referring to. The point of waterboarding is to pry out information about the plans and movements of ISIS from captured ISIS leaders, terrorists and soldiers. They're not innocents and considering for example the affiliated group that they're with drown innocent prisoners in cages slowly submerging the cages in a pond drowning all the unfortunate souls. When a person has a cold and has cancer at the same time do you think they prioritize the cold first and worry about the cancer later? So in the minds of many we need to do away with waterboarding while we let real barbarians decapitate our reporters and charity workers

http://nypost.com/2015/06/24/new-video-shows-isis-slowly-drowning-prisoners-in-a-cage/

http://www.truthandaction.org/isis-sympathizers-douse-british-teen-charity-workers-acid/

 

2)He's a bully. He mocked a disabled reporter.

The reporter in question a year back criticized Trump about his comments of seeing Muslims in New Jersey on the television cheering during 9/11. Of course this same reporter years back actually wrote an article post 9/11 about interviewing the New Jersey Police Department that there had been in fact eyewitnesses to this. Of course when word came out that this reporter basically covered the story that Muslims celebrated who now says that they weren't started going back on his statements Trump commented that "Now that guy, you got to see this guy [begins failing his arms] I don't know what I said I don't remember!"

The news media of course took a shot of Trump failing his arms and released information that the reporter in question was disabled. The fact is Trump never met the man and didn't know what he looked like nor knew that he was disabled. No he never mocked a reporter about his disabilities, but certain news outlets would want you to believe otherwise.

 

3)Cheat. He's declared bankruptcies 4 times.

Wrong

Trump never filed for bankruptcy. Some of his businesses did.

Specifically 4 of his Atlantic City Casinos.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/08/31/news/companies/donald-trump-bankruptcy/

The man owns property all over the world and it comes as a got'cha that basic probability says he's likely to lose some? Try playing chess and retaining all your pieces while taking the opponent's king. Or better yet play monopoly.

Speaking of probability lets look at the statistics on how many American businesses fail. 400,000 new businesses star every year and 470,000 are dying. More businesses are shutting down than springing up. If you think Trump's business bankruptcies make him disqualified you're wrong. Despite the bankrupcies the Trump Organization continues to exist and are quite well off compared to 470,000 other businesses in America.

http://www.successharbor.com/percentage-businesses-fail-09092015

 

4) Claims Muslims cheered on 9/11.

He said it's what he saw on the tv when there is actual footage from CNN of supposed muslims in the middle east on rooftops cheering and celebrating. And refer to my 2nd point. Frankly I don't blame them for celebrating after their land gets ravaged by our government, but it still doesnt mean we must let these people into our home  (considering they consider us  responsible for destroying their homes..that creates a very healthy environment.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-p1LEBAujE

 

5) Racist, called Mexicans rapists and murderers.

First off who considers Mexicans a race? I can fathom a guess, their name starts with an I and ends with a t.

Secondly these are illegal immigrants coming out of Mexico crossing the US border illegally. The law says what they're doing is illegal and thus criminals by the very act of crossing the border without clearance. Around 20 percent of the prison population in US Prisons are filled by people not native to the U.S. Logically if you wanted to reduce prison populations wouldn't you seek to stop letting criminals into the country?

https://www.bop.gov/about/statistics/statistics_inmate_citizenship.jsp

 

Lacking in the image is Trump when he said that illegal immigrants are criminals that he also assumed that some were good people. A man who is willing to give the benefit of the doubt to people crossing the border illegally assuming that some could be good people is a completely rational statement.

As for Mexico sending its people to the U.S. well when a country abuses its people so much and lets rampent drug cartels run freely on the streets it's fair to assume the government is putting their citizens between a rock and a hard place.

5.5) Trump is a xenophobe because of his comments on (illegal) immigrants. First off I don't know how it's a bad thing to place the well-being of your own country and citizens over another country's citizens. For these people who hate government intervention in foreign affairs  I don't get how you could call a guy who opposed the Iraq War from the beginning and someone who was repeatedly made profitable business deals from those of other countries. Let alone the same man who denounced the former leader of France for selling Nuclear weapons/Technology for a profit.

He's running for the President of the United States, not President of the World.

As for nationalism do you think the Swedes living in Sweden want to be called Germans or Canadians living in Canada want to be called Americans?  Usually people who make a residence in a particular country don't want to be referred to as citizens of another country.

6)Sexist. He insults women's looks.

Be honest now, you don't have to tell anyone, but be honest with yourself. Surely in your life you've made some unflattering comment about another person before. Maybe someone from this forum. You really think you can take the "Holier than Thou" approach and preach to Trump on why he's sexist. As for Trump in both his personal and business life he has plenty of women who have worked high up in his company whom he has complimented over and over again for the work they've done (naturally because it was outstanding work).  His own wife for pete's sake manages several properties of the Trump Organization (with a stern approach I might add, but just because she looks like a pretty face and all that you're not realizing the tenacity and intelligence of this woman and that sort of makes you the somewhat sexist person for judging a woman by her looks.)

 

7) Trump is a thug. Advocates violence.

Well when your own supporters try to talk to these protestors and they're beaten up for it, it sort of reflects the saying "an eye for an eye".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TA1S0KQD2W8

A man in California was punched in the back of the head by Trump Protesters while walking away from them.

http://abc7.com/politics/injured-trump-supporter-details-frightening-attack-by-protesters/1316197/

Not to mention Trump Protesters in California chaining themselves to metal pipes blocking traffic.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/30/us/politics/protest-trump-california.html

These protestors are trying to stop Trump rallies. It goes against the principles of free speech in that they're actively seeking to silence speech. The best way to stop a bad idea is let it be said so it can be dismantled in verbal factual debates.

 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Issue #2

I was talking to some people I know from here and mentioned memorial day and the people who served the country. And someone says this:

"nah, because you spend your time typing essays about a guy who said POWs were cowards for getting captured when the defense is kind of like: "Let me tell you why all of these things he said aren't true.... well actually, they are true because he's legit on video saying them, but I'll at least tell you why I don't think it's that bad that he said them""

 

Frankly when I saw this I was surprised the guy cared enough to at least look at the length of my information on Trump and what's been said about him. Of course when I look back on it he always did take time to read Role-play posts whether they were bad or not.

Anywho let's get back on topic.

On Donald Trump which *I assume* he's referring to here

he says that Trump said   POWs were cowards for getting captured.

The guy also said  there is legit VIDEO PROOF THAT HE SAID THAT

heh, I'm glad he mentioned that. Because I got the video here.

Starts at the 50 second mark.

https://youtu.be/7k1ajHAeXMU?t=50s

 

So for those who can't watch the video I'll sum it up.

Basically Trump is talking about a comment McCain made (actually calling) Trump's supporters crazies.

Trump replied in an interview.

Here's the interview's exchange in text.

Trump:”[McCain] insulted me and he insulted everybody in that room. And I said somebody should run against John McCain, who has been in my opinion, not so hot. And I supported him, he lost, he let us down. But he lost and I never liked him much after that ‘cause I don’t like losers. But, but Frank, Frank, let me get to it.”

Frank Luntz: “He’s a war hero. He’s a war hero…”
Trump: “He’s not a war hero…”

Luntz: “He’s a war hero.”

Trump: “He is a war hero…”

Luntz: “Five and a half years in a Vietnamese prison camp…”

Trump: “He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren’t captured. So he’s a war hero…”

Luntz: “Do you agree with that?”

Trump: “He’s a war hero, because he was captured, okay? I believe, perhaps, he’s a war hero. But right now he said some very bad things about a lot of people. So what I said is John McCain, I disagree with him that these people aren’t crazy.”

-------------------------

 

So first off Trump never called any Prisoners of War 'cowards' for being captured. It's a flat out lie to say otherwise. No where does he ever SAY that POWs are cowards. I for one like to focus on what people say and do and not speculate on what they 'may' be saying.

Secondly Trump said about John McCain specifically that he was not a war hero once and said that he was a war hero FIVE TIMES IN THE SAME EXCHANGE!!!

Thirdly my friend commenting on this issue had Trump's statement AS A BROAD GENERALIZATION encompassing EVERY POW

This lol is not true. He never made a broad statement like that about PoWs.

And frankly all he said is that "I like people that weren't captured" So we assume he just hates people who were captured? Um there's always the neutral sense people seem to forget that Trump could be indifferent to POWs. At any point it's idle speculation where no one has a leg to stand on. So you can't say he hates POWs. 

Is it fair to say that Trump doesn't like to see our soldiers captured or our citizens held hostage? I assume it's a negative outcome for your own troops to be captured in war. "No no! I like people who are captured. We need more of them!" I would assume becoming a soldier would be an undesirable lifestyle to most people of the world.  POWs didn't like being captured and would rather not go back to that hell. Most people who touch hot metal don't want to touch it again for a second time.

 

Lastly and this is where it's really obvious to me. 'Bias'--Oh he used the B word watch out guys for hypocrisy!!!

No but I assume the guy who made that statement wasn't being biased about saying what he said but what he "heard" or "saw" on the news.

It would be hard to deny when major News Sites had such headlines...

http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/hes-not-war-hero-donald-trump-mocks-john-mccains-service-n394391

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/donald-trump-john-mccain-war-hero-captured/

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/john-mccain-donald-trump-apologize-veterans/story?id=32561437

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2015/07/18/trump-slams-mccain-for-being-captured-in-vietnam/

http://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.politico.com%2Fstory%2F2015%2F07%2Ftrump-attacks-mccain-i-like-people-who-werent-captured-120317&t=ODcyZThiZDgxOTVhYmY4Mzc5YTllMzJlYzczOTE2MDc5ZDQxNjUxMiwzZ2wwbFRMRw%3D%3D

http://t.umblr.com/redirect?z=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thedailybeast.com%2Farticles%2F2015%2F07%2F18%2Fdraft-dodging-trump-says-pow-mccain-not-a-war-hero.html&t=YzhlY2JjZTYwNzNhNTRhZjFjOTdiZTZiMWRjYzM4YzgwMmMxOTQwNiwzZ2wwbFRMRw%3D%3D

 

People (lying) that Donald Trump made such a blanket statement insulting POWs..no it changed to ALL VETERANS ignore the same type of blanket statement in John McCain (which is TRUE) where he called all of Trump's Supporters crazies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or1r7EQOqvs

 

The video is there on the web in full, the news sites like they always do take words out of context ignore parts of what he was saying and make it into HEADLINES.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfaITehDRdA

Breaking News...this just in. Not all things you hear from a second or third source is true!

One last thing from this guy's quote.

nah, because you spend your time typing essays about a guy who said POWs were cowards for getting captured when the defense is kind of like: "Let me tell you why all of these things he said aren't true.... well actually, they are true because he's legit on video saying them, but I'll at least tell you why I don't think it's that bad that he said them"

I'm not here to make excuses. I'm here to tell you what he said, what people said about him and why it was said.

Does a Scientist look at water turn into a gas and say "Well I don't want to find out why it's turning into a gas because I'd just be making an excuse."

Or a person doing computer science asking the ridiculous question of "How does a compute turn on?"

The two examples both seek to understand why something does another thing. What it means.

When you make a statement you back it up with facts and evidence.

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Hypocrisy

 

"like I totally get acknowledging that Trump might not be as bad as Clinton in one's opinion. But to actually 'support' him shows that you're either racist, ignorant of any of the actual issues, or just brainwashed into thinking you have to vote one party no matter what"

 

*Then claims*

"when Tumblr is so retarded that girl-on-girl is patriarchy"

like it's one of those things where I say feminism makes no sense. If a girl wears skimpy clothing, she's a slave to men's beauty standard and a slut. If a girl dresses modestly, she's a prude who isn't embracing her femininity"

-------

So when it's Donald Trump supporters they're either racist, ignorant, or brainwashed, but you're supposed to get upset when you claim feminism claims something is patriarchy because men  are in too many places of power, are heads of a household or a  sexist wage gap.

If you're a straight white male you got privilege!

If you're a Donald Trump supporter you're racist!

Gezz I can't help sense a correlation here. Hating feminists for labeling you and all men, but you yourself label Trump Supporters RACISTS, IGNORANT, OR BRAINWASHED!!!

I assume the reason why this guy hates feminism is because they attack who he is (being a white male) but doesn't hate labeling Trump Supporters because he isn't one of them.

I'd like to share a small quote

quote-first-they-came-for-the-communists

ooooor...

 

"yeah, so at this point saying white or male priviledge is retarded, when the government gives you a free hand up over anyone who's white or male

class privilege is the real problem

it's not based on gender or race at all, it's that the rich are too rich to not be rich even if they're stupid or unqualified for something"

 

How is Class privilege a problem yet denounce the same mathematical equation that white or male privileged is a problem.

Lets look at the similarities to two examples

------

A man is born with a penis

A baby is born to rich parents

-----

People not born with a penis claim People with a penis has privilege

People who make less money than what that Baby was born into claim Baby has privilege

-----

The man loses his penis thus he is equal with those without a penis as he is now one

Redistributing the wealth from the Baby to people born into less money NOW MAKES THE BABY EQUAL AS HE HAS MONEY EQUAL TO THOSE BORN TO POORER FAMILIES

-------

So is it right to strip a man of his manhood to make him equal to women?

Is it right to force someone to surrender their wealth because they were born under better circumstances than say you?

------------

I guess people without a mother or a father can take someone else's because equality

I guess breaking another kid's Power Rangers toy is justified as you yourself couldn't afford a Power Rangers toy thus now you and the boy don't have a power rangers toy.

 

Uhh not all people are created equal. some born with all their limbs, some not, some born with terminal illnesses, some not, some born to loving rich parents, some born into poverty and is an orphan. What right do we as humans to judge others based on what they have or don't have? We have none for the sole fact we would be taking something else from others to give to more needy people.

Take the Toy example..you could give the boy without a toy another Power Rangers toy

but that is at a cost as with all things

-The parent could have bought the toy, but that requires the exchange of money. Your family suffers a cost in assets in exchange for a happy Child with a toy.

-You could steal*cough*(redistribute) the toy, but the cost is a loss of profit for the toy company. They made the plastic, bought the nuts and screws to piece it together, had workers piece the toy together, buy packaging for the toy, place it in, and ship it to a store. Taking that toy for "free" has cost that toy company money that would've covered the time, materials, and energy to make and sell that toy as well as making a 'profit" so they could spend money to acquire more materials, labor, and land to continue producing toys for children who wish to buy them.

When you say something is free reality says otherwise. It all comes at a cost. So when you steal money from that stupid person born into wealth you're taking money earned by his ancestors.

When you murder someone's child you're robbing parents of all their struggle to become adults, meet their spouse, produce a child, and raise them. You're robbing them of the time they took to feed, cloth, and shelter the boy, robbing them of energy to produce an heir to survive them years after they pass away, and the infinite possibilities that child had for life due to him being given everything he needs to grow and become independent and work and produce children or happy relationships of his own.

When you rob someone of their wealth and give it to others you're robbing that person of CHOICE, to decide how he wants to spend that money whether it's going to produce him more money or drain himself of a significant portion of his cash. In any case the person born into wealth would be giving that money away through the trade as that person would give up his money for something he wanted or needed. Like giving up cash to purchase a car in return or hand over money to buy a loaf of bread.

Instead of focusing on why people are born to better circumstances try improving your own for your own happiness in life. Create your own opportunities in life at the cost of what it took to raise you.

 

Oh...the horror.

 

 

 

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